Interview - Polyphonic
A discussion on album closers: Part I
A few weeks ago, I saw the latest video from Nebula and YouTube’s Polyphonic appear in my algorithms, and it was on a subject close to my heart.
I found myself nodding in agreement as many of the featured tracks are ones we’ve looked at, or I hope to one day (Our index shows you what we have featured so far). So, I contacted Noah and below is the first part of the discussion in which we talked about album closers and other musical topics.
The Run Out Grooves: My initial question is about album sequencing, specifically on closers. What attracted you to this topic? I assume you'll eventually cover openers and other tracks, such as the first track of side two.
Noah (Polyphonic): I've always been fascinated by album sequencing; I'm passionate about it. I often discuss it with friends and mention it on Twitter. As for the closers topic, it was a spontaneous idea that came to me one night as I was trying to sleep. I wrote the script the following day, and it flowed effortlessly. I might explore openers in the future, but I'm also eager to discuss the "record flip" – the sequencing that takes place when one side of a vinyl record ends, and you have to flip it to the other side.
A great example is The Beatles’ Abbey Road, where ‘I Want You’ builds tension and abruptly stops, leaving you with a moment to breathe before flipping the record and being greeted by ‘Here Comes the Sun’, which provides the ultimate release. I'm considering whether to make this the subject of its own video or include it in a larger piece about my love for vinyl as a medium.
While I may eventually address openers since the closer video was well-received, I try not to revisit topics too often on my channel. I prefer to explore various concepts instead of repeatedly focusing on the same idea.
The Run Out Grooves: Flipping sides is intriguing; I wonder about Neil Young's On the Beach, where the original backside was meant to be the front side. It's fascinating to consider how the album would feel if you started with side B and then moved to side A, as it was initially intended.
Noah: Another interesting example is Kendrick Lamar's DAMN. which can be listened to both front-to-back and back-to-front. There's even a deluxe vinyl edition with the tracks sequenced in reverse order. Listening to the album both ways offers unique experiences, like mirror reflections of one another. It's a compelling experiment in sequencing.
The Run Out Grooves: Surprisingly, there isn’t much experimentation in this area, especially considering how easy it is to rearrange tracks. Kanye West's The Life of Pablo underwent multiple iterations even after its release. While director's cuts of movies often include additional footage, music rarely sees that kind of alteration. Extra tracks are often added to deluxe editions, but they usually seem like afterthoughts rather than well-thought-out parts of the album's sequence.
Noah: I appreciated how Kanye's approach to The Life of Pablo encouraged listeners to create their ideal sequence. Similarly, Brian Wilson's Smile box set allowed fans to arrange their favourite version of what Smile could have been. This kind of experimentation is an area ripe for exploration, especially in the digital age.
The Run Out Grooves: When Radiohead released A Moon Shaped Pool, and it first leaked, people noticed that the tracklist was alphabetical and wondered if it was confirmed. The Pixies have also performed entire shows in alphabetical order. It's fascinating to think about the intention behind these decisions and how they impact the listening experience. When I wrote about OK Computer and the closing track, ‘The Tourist’, I dug out an interview where the band confirmed that the idea of the non-slowing down idiot is the person saved in ‘Airbag’.
Noah: Pink Floyd, particularly with The Wall, also played with cyclical sequencing. The final track, ‘Outside the Wall’, ends with a fragmented sound clip, while the opening track, ‘In the Flesh’, starts with the continuation of that clip. It gives a sense of a never-ending cycle, much like the album's concept, which revolves around the cyclical nature of trauma. For many, The Wall is an eye-opening example of what an album can achieve as a medium. Tool also have songs that can be played simultaneously with others, creating a cohesive experience.
The Run Out Grooves: There's a rumour that you can sequence Radiohead's OK Computer and In Rainbows by alternating their tracks, creating a seamless flow. With today's technology, such experimentation is even more accessible. Another example is The Flaming Lips' album Zaireeka, which requires playing four CDs simultaneously. Surprisingly, more artists don't explore this kind of experimentation. For instance, recording rhythm guitar and vocals on one track and bass and drums on another, then playing them simultaneously to create a complete song. It's similar to how old Beatles records had separate channels for each instrument.
In the video, you discussed different categories of album endings, like big freak-out endings, cheerful goodbyes, and contemplative ballads. Another interesting approach is when the closing track gives a sneak preview of what's to come in an artist's subsequent work. This isn't always limited to the final track, as seen in ‘Queen Bitch’ on David Bowie's Hunky Dory and ‘The Word’ on The Beatles' Rubber Soul, which could easily fit into their subsequent albums. These tracks are like TV episodes ending with a "Tune in next week" message, offering a glimpse into what's ahead.
Noah: Early Bowie's music shows a clear trajectory of his artistic development. Similarly, Pink Floyd's ‘Echoes’ from Meddle previews their sound in the trilogy of albums The Dark Side of the Moon, Wish You Were Here, and Animals.
The Run Out Grooves: One of the things that has struck me is that for some of these most famous album closers, entire books have been written about particular songs, while other great tracks have very little information available online. Jazz is one genre where this disparity is evident, with some standards receiving extensive academic analysis while other powerful album cuts remain relatively obscure.
Noah: Curtis Mayfield is an example of an artist whose work deserves more attention. His albums have exceptional sequencing and explore important themes but have yet to receive the recognition they deserve. Songs like ‘We the People Who Are Darker Than Blue’ and ‘Move On Up’ could be discussed in the same way as ‘Stairway to Heaven’ or other iconic tracks.
The Run Out Grooves: Some artists have had incredible runs of success in a short time, like Stevie Wonder's Innervisions through Songs in the Key of Life, which were released close together in a perfect run. This level of achievement is rarely seen nowadays, with artists like Radiohead, Kendrick Lamar, and Kanye West having successful runs over a more extended period. The speed at which artists like Bowie, The Beatles, and Bob Dylan released their groundbreaking works is remarkable.
Noah: Dylan’s whole electric trilogy spans a period shorter than many countries’ COVID-19 lockdowns lasted. Another factor that means those periods are much longer now is economics. Musicians used to make money from record sales, but now they make money from touring. So, significant artists often release an album and then tour for 18 months to two years, which is a gruelling process. It's not surprising that musicians need time to relax after such an intense tour before releasing another album and starting the cycle again. However, some artists, like King Gizzard & the Lizard Wizard and Vince Staples, are becoming more comfortable releasing music frequently without following the traditional album-tour cycle. An interesting example of how touring impacts album releases is Led Zeppelin. They released four albums between 1969 and 1971, then started doing global stadium tours, resulting in less frequent album releases. Creating music is a passion, but it's also a job, and if artists could make the same money with fewer releases, they might do so.
The Run Out Grooves: Are there any album closers that you think don't work?
Noah: I can't think of any specific examples, but there are many album closers that I'm not a fan of, like power ballads or slow, uninteresting songs. Additionally, some artists can only maintain their vision for half a record, making the second half feel trite. Double albums like Genesis' The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway can also drag on. If you t off after the first disc, that's a perfect album. The second disc stretches out longer than it needs to be. I think on that happens with double albums. Physical Graffiti is a great album, but do I need anything on the fourth side of that? I've got no issue with ‘The Wanton Song’ or ‘Sick Again’, but they are not essential Led Zeppelin.
The Run Out Grooves: When artists get double albums right, they sometimes think they can do a triple album or include unnecessary tracks. You only need to listen to ‘Shepherd’s Delight’ or the children signing ‘Career Opportunities’ on Sandinista! Quality control is essential, and sometimes limitations can enhance the art. For example, vinyl's 40-45 minute limit makes artists more selective with their tracks.
Noah: That's true, and when artists don't exercise quality control, their albums can suffer. Limitations can be beneficial to the creative process.
The Run Out Grooves: It always amazes me how bands like The Beatles had such a hectic schedule. They released a double album and a couple of singles, including ‘Hey Jude’, all in the same six-month stretch. And then they returned to recording another album with a self-imposed deadline for a TV special.
Noah: Yeah, it's impressive but also a bit crazy. Speaking of The Beatles, the first released version of Let It Be had some poor album sequencing. ‘Get Back’, for example, would have been a great album opener, but it's actually the closer. The Long and Winding Road’ is also misplaced in the middle of side two. It's interesting how album sequencing can make a difference. Abbey Road, for example, is maybe one of the greatest sequenced albums of all time.
The Run Out Grooves: Definitely. Some bands do get it right when they discuss and refine. Then you have someone like U2 with The Joshua Tree who delegated the tracklisting to Kirsty Maccoll.1 But there are also some strange choices, like having 'Don't You Want Me Baby' at the end of The Human League's album, Dare! or ‘The Message’ as the closing track on the Grandmaster Flash album of the same name.
Noah: Sometimes, these choices might be made by executives or due to technical constraints of the vinyl. It's hard to know and can make or break an album. Take Hozier, for instance. I love his work, but both his albums feel poorly sequenced, possibly due to executive decisions. ‘Take Me to Church’ is the opening song on the debut, which I don't think it should be. On Wasteland Baby, ‘Like Nina Cried’ at least opens with “It's not the waking, it's the rising”, which is a pretty good opening. If they were better sequenced and trimmed, they could be some of the best albums of their decade.
The Run Out Grooves: One interesting aspect I found while writing about album closers was Thriller. Seven of 9 songs are singles, and ‘The Lady in My Life’ is one of the few non-singles. Yet, when you listen to it away from the album, it could fit into contemporary radio, sounding like a 2010 R&B pop song. Similarly, Prince's ‘Adore’ from Sign O’ the Times has that quality. And interestingly, The XX’s ‘Stars’ has a minimalist and breathy interplay and has become a template for many popular artists, even getting sampled extensively. These album-ending songs, which may not be as grand as others, still need to clear some creative hurdles to make it onto the record, and sometimes they become influential in music direction.
Noah: That's an interesting perspective, considering how the end of an album can be a space for more experimental sounds, catering to true fans and hardcore elements who can appreciate the artist's efforts in those tracks. You can see this in The Rolling Stones with ‘You Can't Always Get What You Want’ and Let It Bleed, where the album sequencing is well thought-out.
The Run Out Grooves: Another example of solid album endings is Pixies' Doolittle with ‘Gouge Away’, which doesn't get as much attention as other tracks on that record. However, so far, Joy Division's Closer stands out with its final three tracks, culminating in ‘Decades’. It's a powerful ending, especially considering the context of Ian Curtis' life and death.
Noah: The sequencing in David Bowie's Ziggy Stardust is also notable, with the album's energy maintained through the final tracks, ‘Ziggy Stardust’, ‘Suffragette City’, and ‘Rock 'n' Roll Suicide’. This creates a unique experience for the listener, and those songs could have easily been split and pushed further forward on the album’s second side. Another example is Bowie's ‘I Can't Give Everything Away’ from Blackstar, a haunting closer. The harmonica line in that song refers to his earlier work in Berlin in 1977, specifically, ‘A Career In A New Town,’ adding another layer of emotion to his final track.
Next week: The second part of this interview
For new readers, here is a playlist of every track we’ve written about at The Run Out Grooves.
Rather than delegating this job to a random 1980s artist, MacColl was married to Steve Lillywhite, who mixed the album.